EP. 220 — Sasheer Is Better at Pilates Than Expected! with Kenny DeForest & David Drake

Sasheer [00:00:00] There’s no better way to experience Oregon than through the eyes of those who know it best. Oregon’s guides know the best secret spots and unique destinations, and some even have access to locations usually closed to the public. Plus, Oregon’s certified tour guides and outfitters provide safety gear and ensure you’re doing the activity safely. Find an incredible guide to experience for your needs and interests, whether you’re into Singletrack mountain biking or need a wheelchair accessible tour. Visit traveloregon.com to find your perfect guide today. 

Nicole [00:00:32] You know what? It’s very important for children to have the educational support that they need to keep up, you know, the standards of their grades and stuff. If you’re a parent and you want to be doing everything you can to set your child up for success in life, you got to make sure to check out IXL. IXL as an online learning program for kids. Use it on your computer, phone, or tablet. IXL covers math, language arts, science, and social studies through interactive practice problems from pre-K to 12th grade. IXL even has skill plans for specific textbooks. You’ll save so much money, too. Memberships start at only $9.95 a month. With the school year ramping up, now is the time to get IXL. Our listeners can get an exclusive 20% off IXL membership when they sign up today at ixl.com/bestfriends. Visit ixl.com/bestfriends to get the most effective learning program out there at the best price. Hi, Sasheer. 

Sasheer [00:01:45] Hi, Nicole. 

Nicole [00:01:46] How are you? 

Sasheer [00:01:48] Good. I did Pilates today. 

Nicole [00:01:52] Wow. And how do you feel? 

Sasheer [00:01:55] Really good. I was scared. I was actually really intimidated because I assumed it would be way too hard for me. Like, I was just like, “Oh, everyone–they all have, like, muscles I don’t have.” I just thought it was going to be really, really, really, really hard. And then I got in there and, like, there were all types of ladies in there. There was, like, an older lady. There were ladies with, like, injuries. And they couldn’t do everything. 

Nicole [00:02:30] Was there a fat one? 

Sasheer [00:02:31] Not in this class. No. 

Nicole [00:02:32] Yeah, okay. 

Sasheer [00:02:34] But I’m sure they do take the classes. 

Nicole [00:02:36] We’re not allowed. No, I’m kidding. 

Sasheer [00:02:39] “What’s this sign that says, ‘No Fatties’ at the door?” 

Nicole [00:02:44] Oh, that’d be so funny. You’re inside, and then a fat lady walks up and is like, “That’s what I thought,” and had to, like, walk away. Pilates is with the machine, right? You have to do stuff on a machine? 

Sasheer [00:02:55] Yeah. And there’s different kinds of machines. I’ve never seen this particular one. This one had a thing called a jump board where it’s like a flat board in front of you. And you push off of it and, like, jump and do stuff. You’re laying down. Your backs, like, on the pad. And then your feet are, like, flat on this vertical board. And then you push off and bounce and, like, roll back and forth. 

Nicole [00:03:29] Oh! Okay. 

Sasheer [00:03:30] Yeah, it was fun. 

Nicole [00:03:31] Interesting. It sounds like fun. I love an exercise where I can lay down. 

Sasheer [00:03:37] And that was the best part. I was like, “I’m really tired.” 

Nicole [00:03:40] Go exercise and go right to sleep. Goodbye!

Sasheer [00:03:45] Yeah. How are you? 

Nicole [00:03:47] I’m good. I did not do Pilates today, but Clyde and I went to CVS. I love CVS. 

Sasheer [00:03:58] I love CVS. 

Nicole [00:03:58] Boy, oh boy. I put him in his little bag. His little head is out. And everyone goes, “Oh!” And then he’s very excited to greet the people at CVS. 

Sasheer [00:04:10] That’s nice. 

Nicole [00:04:11] It was a nice calm morning. I’ve been, like, running errands since returning back home. And that’s been, like, you know, nice. Running errands is nice. I’m doing a little laundry. I got my car washed today. She is what? Productive! 

Sasheer [00:04:26] It does feel really, really nice when you’re, like, checking all the things off your list and you’re like, “That’s done. That’s done. That feels good.” 

Nicole [00:04:34] Yeah. And I think I might be becoming a morning person. 

Sasheer [00:04:38] Oh, whoa. What time did you get up?

Nicole [00:04:41] I woke up at 9:00 before my alarm clock. I know 9:00 is not early for some, but for me, it is early. And I woke up without my alarm clock. And I think it’s because I went to different time zones where people kept planning things early. And I’d be like, “Well, I have to be up.” So now my body’s like, “Well, you gotta get up for something.” 

Sasheer [00:04:59] Oooh. Do you think you’ll stick to that? 

Nicole [00:05:03] I am going to try. Yeah, it’s nice that I’ve got so many things done, and it’s only 3:00 PM. 

Sasheer [00:05:08] That’s really nice. 

Nicole [00:05:09] I have a whole night, baby, to do whatever this bitch wants. 

Sasheer [00:05:14] Well, not whatever because we are getting dinner. 

Nicole [00:05:16] “I’m going to do whatever I want, and I’ll back off my commitments and not do a single thing that I’m supposed to do! I’m my own woman because I’m a morning bitch now!” 

Sasheer [00:05:29] But we are going to hang out at night because we agreed to it, remember? 

Nicole [00:05:32] “Maybe I’ll build a slide of sorts all night!”

Sasheer [00:05:38] You’re going to build a slide at night?

Nicole [00:05:39] I couldn’t figure out what I was going to build. I was like, “I don’t know.” 

Sasheer [00:05:43] “Build a slide of sorts.” Well, speaking of building, let’s bring out two people who built a long-lasting friendship amongst the two of them. 

Nicole [00:05:54] Yes, that was a beautiful segue. 

Sasheer [00:05:57] Thank you so much. 

Nicole [00:05:57] Honestly, I think you should teach an extension course at some community college about segues. And not a regular university, though. Two years. 

Sasheer [00:06:10] What? 

Nicole [00:06:11] Community college–two years. 

Sasheer [00:06:13] Yeah. And it’s a continuous class. Like, it never ends because it’s like, “And that leads me to my next point.” It just keeps continuing. 

Nicole [00:06:22] And then everyone’s like, “Is this a scam?” 

Sasheer [00:06:24] Yeah. “Why isn’t it ending?” 

Nicole [00:06:27] “Am I getting credit?” Okay, I’ll let you talk. 

Sasheer [00:06:31] Well, today we’re doing Besting Each Other. 

Nicole [00:06:36] Best friends who are not us! 

Sasheer [00:06:39] We do talks of best friends who are not us about their friendship. And we put them to the test. Today, we have Kenny DeForest, who is a stand-up comedian, writer, actor, best known for his appearances on Late Night with Seth Meyers and The Late Late Show with James Corden. And his first stand-up album, Bad Dreams, debuted number one on iTunes. And his new special–Don’t You Know Who I Am?–is out right now on YouTube. 

Nicole [00:07:03] We have a second person, David Drake. He is a comedian and was featured on Comedy Central, HBO, SiriusXM, and Fox. He is the producer of a weekly comedy show called Comedians You Should Know in New York City. His stand-up special, That’s It, will be released later this fall. And you can look for all that info on his Instagram @daviddrakecomedy or his website davidrakecomedy.com. Please welcome David Drake! Here we are with another segment of Do You Know Your Friend Is Your Real Friend? on Best Friends. 

Sasheer [00:07:47] Besting Each Other? 

David [00:07:48] Long segment name? 

Sasheer [00:07:50] Yes. 

Nicole [00:07:52] Sure. Sure. It really does. Guess what? I like to have fun. I don’t like for people to know what’s coming. I am fun. Okay. 

Sasheer [00:08:02] So first up we have… 

Nicole [00:08:04] Yeah, you do it because you’re doing it good. 

Sasheer [00:08:10] The first half of our best friend pair that we have–very funny comedian, buddy from way back in the day, and all-around good guy–we have David Drake!

David [00:08:20] Hey, thank you. 

Sasheer [00:08:22] Thank you. 

David [00:08:23] And good buddy now, I hope. 

Sasheer [00:08:25] Yes, good buddy now, too. I think you got the rundown, but we’re going to quiz you on your friendship with Kenny and see if you really are friends. And if not, you have to end your friendship. 

Nicole [00:08:40] You have to end your friendship and move. That’s a new thing I’ve added. 

Sasheer [00:08:44] Oh, the stakes are getting higher. 

David [00:08:47] Far away. 

Nicole [00:08:47] You have to leave your whole life.

David [00:08:50] I leave my family. All right. Stakes are high. 

Sasheer [00:08:54] Yeah. 

Nicole [00:08:55] All right, let’s hop right into it. One hop this time. How did you two meet? 

David [00:09:02] We met in Chicago. We were both doing open mic. And then it was one of those things where, like, you are kind of aware of a person before you meet them, where, like, I saw him, and we had similar friends. And I was like, “I will eventually be friends with Kenny if not now, sometime soon.” 

Sasheer [00:09:28] Do you know how long it was where you were aware of Kenny before you actually became friends? 

David [00:09:33] It was probably, like, eight months, maybe?

Sasheer [00:09:39] That’s a pretty precise number.

David [00:09:43] I keep a journal–a Kenny Count Off. Well, like, when I got to Chicago, I didn’t have any friends at all. I just kind of moved in cold. And so around eight months is when I started to feel like I had, like, an established group. So that’s kind of what I’m basing that off. 

Sasheer [00:10:04] That’s when you meet all your friends. 

David [00:10:06] Yeah. Kenny was absorbed in that eight-month date. 

Nicole [00:10:12] Do you remember what open mic it was that you met Kenny at? 

David [00:10:16] Well, Kenny used to run a show called Speakeasy in the bottom of this, like, restaurant called Stanley’s. And then he also used to run a show at this place called The Spot in Uptown Chicago. And so, I would go to those shows and I would watch and see Kenny. And then he would be at this open mic called the Gutter Mouth run by this guy, Bill Crews, who maybe you know. He’s an LA boy now. Well, that was a fun… Was it in a bowling match? No, it wasn’t in a bowling alley. It was in just a regular bar. 

Sasheer [00:11:02] Do you remember what, like, conversation happened where you guys were like, “Oh, this feels good. Like, now we’re clicking.”

David [00:11:12] I really only start specifically remembering Kenny in my life when we went to, like, Bonnaroo in 2012. And that was where we started chatting all the time. And so, we became friends eight months in, and then it still took another year to strengthen the friendship to something deeper. 

Sasheer [00:11:39] Yeah. Okay. 

Nicole [00:11:39] A little slow burn. 

David [00:11:44] Yeah, it took a little while, but all good things do. 

Sasheer [00:11:48] That makes sense because when you’re doing comedy, you’re, like, surrounded by comedians, so you’re like, “I like you.” But you haven’t, like, made an in-depth connection yet. 

David [00:11:56] Yeah, you’re not, like, people to each other until you actually get to, like, hang out doing something not stand-up.

Sasheer [00:12:06] Not comedy. That makes sense. What is your favorite memory of traveling together? 

David [00:12:14] I mean, Kenny’s been on, I think, every trip I’ve taken in my adult life. We’d do these, like, little boys trips every year to the woods. 

Nicole [00:12:29] That’s a wild way to phrase that. “We took little boys’ trips.”

David [00:12:37] Big boy trips. Grown man trips. My wife calls them “boys’ trips.” 

Nicole [00:12:44] It was just the “little” that was a little concerning. 

David [00:12:46] That’s my fault. 

Sasheer [00:12:47] It’s like, “Are there children involved in this?”

David [00:12:50] I shouldn’t have said “little.” We’re all really big. Regular sized trips. 

Nicole [00:12:59] So you take your big boy trips? 

David [00:13:01] Big boy trips. But I guess I toured with Kenny once in Texas. And we were in San Antonio, and we did this, like, late night walk along the river to that, like, mall. Have you ever been to San Antonio? 

Sasheer [00:13:20] Not in a very long time. 

Nicole [00:13:21] Maybe. 

David [00:13:22] Oh, it’s good. 

Nicole [00:13:27] “You gotta get down there! It’s good!”

Sasheer [00:13:29] There’s an outdoor mall there? Is that what you said?

David [00:13:32] Yes, they have a mall that, like, you can walk out, and it’s just this river where it has, like, restaurants and apartments and trees. It’s a river. 

Nicole [00:13:47] So it’s like The Grove with a river?

Sasheer [00:13:49] “Fish and ducks and…”

David [00:13:51] “If you can imagine, it’s the ocean skinny. Right through a town.” So, yeah, we had this, like, one long, beautiful, little walk. I don’t know why this is the specific memory coming up. 

Sasheer [00:14:04] No, no. It sounds like it meant a lot. It’s very sweet. 

David [00:14:11] I have so many memories of Kenny, but this is, like, the only time… That tour was the only time we were traveling–just me and him. And so that was, like, after the shows. We did this long… Yeah. It’s just like no one was around. It was a good walk. 

Sasheer [00:14:32] Nice. 

Nicole [00:14:34] Okay. What is your favorite thing about your friend Kenny? 

David [00:14:41] What do I like about Kenny? He’s really good at bringing drugs across state lines. I think that’s a very admirable quality of Kenny. 

Sasheer [00:14:55] Not everyone has the skills. 

Nicole [00:14:59] Some people get caught and go to jail. 

David [00:15:01] I’m too scared to do it. I’m kind of shocked, actually. Our last trip that we took this year, he brought… It looked like a pound of mushrooms on a plane in his backpack. 

David [00:15:20] It was like this. This much. 

Sasheer [00:15:23] Was it hidden? 

David [00:15:24] No. It’s just in this little… It looked like a travel case, where you’d have, like, toothpaste and a toothbrush and contacts solution. 

Sasheer [00:15:36] Like a toiletries bag? 

David [00:15:39] Yeah. You know what I’m saying. 

Nicole [00:15:39] Yeah. Here’s what I’ve learned: Nobody cares. In France, they were like, “You have to take out all of your toiletries and put them in one little bag. And if it doesn’t fit this one little bag, you show it to us and dump it. You got to get rid of your toiletries.” And I said, “That’s not a game I’m willing to play.” So, she said, “Do you have toiletries? You have liquids?” And I said, “No.” I had so many. I had bags and bags and bags filled with little toiletries–little liquids. And I went through the thing, nobody said a fucking word. You can bring anything you want on a plane. You just gotta say, “I don’t have it.” 

Sasheer [00:16:14] I feel like you just got lucky. I don’t want people to, like, take this advice and be like, “Well, I guess I can bring anything on a plane. That’s that.”

David [00:16:25] But I feel like she’s right because I don’t know… No one’s ever questioned anything I’ve had in my backpack. 

Sasheer [00:16:33] I’ve gotten stopped. Well, I guess I’ve mostly gotten stopped for candles. And I guess why am I bringing candles? But I don’t know. If I’m, like, somewhere and I got a candle as a gift or, like, I’m giving a gift as a candle, I often get stopped and they pull it out and they’re like, “What’s this?” And then they look at it and go, “Oh, it’s a candle.” But I’m like, “Why every time?”

David [00:16:58] I’ve been stopped for candles, too.

Nicole [00:17:02] It’s a solid mass. They want to know what that solid mass is. It’s like, “Are you going to bludgeon everyone on the plane? What is it?” That’s why they stop you.

David [00:17:09] It’s like a sneaky liquid. 

Sasheer [00:17:11] Yeah, I can melt it, and then… 

David [00:17:14] And then it’s liquid. And they don’t like that. 

Sasheer [00:17:16] Create acid?

Nicole [00:17:16] And then have a sexy time with everyone on the plane. 

Sasheer [00:17:19] And they don’t want that. Not on a plane. No. 

David [00:17:25] Distracting. 

Nicole [00:17:25] When I came back from Amsterdam, I had a bunch of rubber duckies in my bag. And they went through my bag, and that lady took out every rubber ducky and she laughed at me. That didn’t feel good. That’s the only time I’ve been stopped. She took out my Cher duck, and she really laughed. 

David [00:17:42] Wait. She just took them out to make fun of you? 

Nicole [00:17:47] Yeah. I think through the thing, they were like, “These are duck shaped things. Let’s get to the bottom of it. Let’s laugh at her.” And that’s what they did. And I had a sonic duck, and she really laughed about that. Yeah, it was a little heartbreaking for me. 

Sasheer [00:18:00] Maybe she just wanted to get all your ducks in a row. 

Nicole [00:18:03] Boo! O 

Sasheer [00:18:07] Come on.

David [00:18:19] Do you have, like, a duck collection? 

Nicole [00:18:22] Yeah. Yeah, I got a lot of ducks. I got a rubber duck. I got a tattoo of a duck. I got so many ducks. 

Sasheer [00:18:28] She loves a duck.

Nicole [00:18:29] I love a duck! 

Sasheer [00:18:32] Okay, next question. If you had to guess, what would you say Kenny’s favorite thing is about you? 

David [00:18:40] I think Kenny likes how, like, simply I speak. Not that Kenny’s dumb or anything, but he said to me before he likes how I just say things. I don’t really doll it up. 

Sasheer [00:19:08] Like, how literal you are?

David [00:19:10] I think if I’m throwing shade at a friend, it’s usually just a… He likes word economy. 

Nicole [00:19:23] So very few words–simple words. 

David [00:19:25] I think that’s what Kenny likes about me.

Nicole [00:19:31] No thethua– Thethaur–? How do I say that word? 

Sasheer [00:19:34] “Thesaurus.”

David [00:19:35] “Thesaurus.”

Nicole [00:19:41] “Thesaurus.” Wow. That was tough for me. 

Sasheer [00:19:44] You added an extra “th” sound. “Thethauruth.” You actually added two.

David [00:19:52] It’s hard to think of these things on the spot. I hope that’s not the wrong answer. 

Nicole [00:19:59] No, no, no, no. 

Sasheer [00:20:00] I mean, so far, it’s not the wrong answer. 

David [00:20:04] Yeah, we’ll see. 

Nicole [00:20:06] Then we’ll see what the wrong answer is. What is it that you do that drives Kenny crazy? 

David [00:20:13] Like, make him mad or…?

Sasheer [00:20:15] Frustrated.

David [00:20:20] The only times Kenny has been really mad at me is on our little boys’ trips. We’ll be going on a hike, and I’ll wander off a little too far. And Kenny will get really mad. So, I guess the answer is wandering off makes Kenny crazy. He likes when you’re close. 

Nicole [00:20:45] Is it because you’re not telling people where you’re going? 

David [00:20:47] Like, we’ll just be walking on a straight… It’s like a hike, so it’s like there’s a trail. And then I’ll just get a little too far away just because sometimes you want peace. And then he won’t be able to see me for a while. And so, he’s like, “Oh, this is dangerous out here. And you’re all by yourself.” So, the only time Kenny has ever been really mad was I got a little too far away and then they turned around and then I hiked back in the dark. And they were, like, worried. And Kenny yelled at me, and it felt kind of scary. 

Sasheer [00:21:34] Were you scared when you were hiking back in the dark? 

David [00:21:36] No. I mean, I was with one other friend, and we had flashlights. And it was pretty easy, to… I wasn’t concerned. But Kenny thought we were dead. 

Nicole [00:21:47] Yeah. That’s scary. 

David [00:21:48] Yeah, we were gone probably 45 minutes in the dark, where they didn’t know where we were. So, it’s totally understandable. But yeah, I did get that sinking feeling, like, when your dad yells at you. 

Sasheer [00:22:05] Yeah. 

David [00:22:06] Yeah. Where you’re like, “Oh no…” Like, being in the principal’s office, waiting for them to call you in. 

Nicole [00:22:14] I mean, it’s scary to wander off alone. What if there’s a bear? Or a family? What if the Berenstain Bears are out there? 

David [00:22:26] Oh, a bear family–not just any family.

Sasheer [00:22:26] I thought you meant just, like, a human family. 

David [00:22:29] What if there was a human family out there? 

Sasheer [00:22:30] That’s terrifying. There’s children in there. 

David [00:22:33] They’re looking to absorb you.

Sasheer [00:22:34] They’re all related. 

David [00:22:37] I will say on these trips, I fear running into a family more than I do running into a bear. 

Sasheer [00:22:46] Okay. What is something that Kenny does that drives you crazy? 

David [00:22:53] Honestly, there’s not too much that makes my friends… Like, my friends very rarely make me mad or upset. However, Kenny–very talented stand-up comedian–occasionally he’ll have, like, an awful sketch idea, and he’ll try to like… “What do you think about this?” And I can see in his eyes that he just really believes in it, and he needs me to also believe in it. So, I’m like, “Oh, yeah.” And then now I’m thinking of ideas that are piggybacking this bad idea–none of it’s going to go anywhere. And that can be that can be, like… I guess that’s the only moment of tension, and only I feel it. And he would never know if I didn’t just reveal it. 

Nicole [00:23:53] He’s going to know soon enough. 

Sasheer [00:23:57] Yeah, like, the energy is sweeping you up into this thing that you didn’t even want to sign on to. 

David [00:24:04] Yeah. He has plenty of good ideas, too. But you know… 

Nicole [00:24:10] He’s also got bad ones. 

David [00:24:12] Yeah. I don’t want a part of that. 

Nicole [00:24:17] Which one of you would do better on the CBS television series–long running–Survivor. 

David [00:24:26] It is long running. God, that was around when I was like, five–eight?

Nicole [00:24:35] I think it’s on Season, like, 37 or something crazy. 42. 

David [00:24:38] It’s been around my whole life. It’s crazy. All right. Kenny would do better. He’s always sending me links to camel packs and, like, interesting shoes…

Nicole [00:25:00] “Interesting shoes.” Hiking shoes, sneakers, Divas? What kind of shoes? 

David [00:25:05] Yeah, hiking shoes. Maybe some, like, shoes that you can walk in the water and then back out of the water. 

Nicole [00:25:12] Adventure shoes. I do like an adventure shoe. 

David [00:25:16] Yeah. He’s brought bear mace on trips before. 

Sasheer [00:25:19] Oh, that’s smart. 

David [00:25:20] Yeah. No, Kenny knows that there’s some risks, and so he prepares for them. So, he would do better. 

Sasheer [00:25:31] Well, also, based on your description of a river, I believe that. 

Nicole [00:25:34] Yeah, same.

David [00:25:36] I don’t know what a river is. I wander off. And he’s going to do better. 

Sasheer [00:25:42] Last question. What do you hope you’re both doing 20 years from now? 

David [00:25:51] I don’t know. I hope we both have some money, or one of us has money. 

Nicole [00:25:58] Only one? Do you think that one’s gonna share?

David [00:26:03] Someone needs to make money. All right, if only one can have it, I hope I have the money. But if we’re both allowed to make money, I hope we both have money. Yeah, I hope we’re both not working at a moving company. Yeah, that’s my goal for us–not working at a moving company. 

Nicole [00:26:24] Yeah, dream big! 

Sasheer [00:26:26] Yeah, I’m going to challenge you to dream a little bigger than that. I feel like that’s a goal that can happen in a year. What do you want in 20 years? 

Nicole [00:26:36] Yeah, 20 years from now. The year 2043. 

David [00:26:41] All right. So, the world is ash and dust. Me and Kenny–we both got some new adventure shoes, and Kenny’s got a face mask for me. And we’re walking into it together as the flames lick at the gray burning sky. 

Nicole [00:27:06] You want this to be your answer? 

David [00:27:10] Where do I see myself in 20 years? In a nice house. My daughter is going to a great school. Maybe Kenny has a daughter, too. And they’re friends. Yeah. How’s that one? 

Sasheer [00:27:27] That one’s great. 

Nicole [00:27:27] That one’s nice. I like that one. 

David [00:27:30] We’ll use that one and not the other one.

Sasheer [00:27:32] The apocalyptic…

Nicole [00:27:34] Yeah, that one’s a little bit of a bummer. I don’t want to live through an apocalypse. 

David [00:27:40] Neither do I. 

Sasheer [00:27:43] Okay, cool. 

David [00:27:44] So we both have daughters, and they’re friends. 

Sasheer [00:27:48] I love that. 

Nicole [00:27:50] That’s great. 

Sasheer [00:27:53] All right. Now, we’re going to bring Kenny in, ask the same questions, and see if you really are friends. 

David [00:27:59] All right, let’s do it. 

Sasheer [00:28:09] It might still be hot outside, but fall is right around the corner. And you got to get prepared. You got to get some warm hats, some fuzzy socks, some mittens, some scarves! Target has so many great brands–so many good fashion styles. I’ve gotten a lot of compliments on some matching sets that I’ve got from Target. They have good sweats and sweatshirts and sweatpants. They’ve got accessories. I’ve gotten purses from there–little backpacks and little clutches that are good in a clutch. You can get all of that in one spot, and that’s Target. Shop the latest women’s fashions at your local Target store or online at target.com.

Nicole [00:28:50] Isn’t it obnoxious when companies have those sneaky gadgets hiding deep in the fine print or bills that seem to go up for no dang reason. Oh boy! There’s a lot of yada yada yadas I’ve encountered in my life, like budget airlines that promised a cheap fare but then charge you for every little thing until you realize you’re paying more. You could have gone somewhere else! Actually, brands usually want me to say a lot of yada yada when I do ads like this. At Metro by T-Mobile, there is not a yada yada yada. That means no contracts, no price hikes, no surprises. They don’t even want me to speed through the legal. So here it is. When they say no price hikes when you join, they mean your price will never increase for talk, text, and smartphone data plans. Their only exclusions are for limited time promos, per use charges, and third-party services. I guess that really is not a yada yada. Metro by T-Mobile–not a yada yada. Okay. Kenny. It’s time. We’re going to test you on your friendship. 

Kenny [00:29:52] I’m so excited. 

Nicole [00:29:54] Yeah. We have a very good friend of ours–a very good friend of David Drake’s. And now we’re going to test your friendship. 

Kenny [00:30:01] Bring it on. I pride myself on friendship. Let’s go. 

Nicole [00:30:05] That’s a funny thing to pride yourself on, and I like it. 

Kenny [00:30:08] That’s right. I’m a great friend. We’ll see. 

Nicole [00:30:12] You are a good friend. Here is the first question. How did you two meet? 

Kenny [00:30:20] We met doing stand-up comedy in Chicago. And my first memory… He remembers from before this. My first memory of Dave was we were doing the open mic at Jokes and Notes on the South Side of Chicago, which is a predominantly Black comedy club that is now closed. And Dave was in flip-flops and shorts, and he just crushed. And it was the kind of crush that the audience was like, “We can’t believe how much we like this guy.” His set ended, the music started to play, the host wasn’t in the room, and Dave did not know what to do. And he just started freestyle rapping, which by the way, I’ve heard him try to freestyle rap multiple times since this. It is an unmitigated nightmare. It always just devolves to him saying, “Suck my dick” a bunch of times. Like, it’s not good. But on this night, he caught a flow. And he had, like, four bars in a row that were legitimately good. And the crowd just started going crazy. And then the host came back onstage and was like, “Keep it going for that guy.” And the people were up on their feet. And I was like, “That guy is going to be my friend.”

Sasheer [00:31:36] Oh, I love that. 

Kenny [00:31:39] Yeah. 

Nicole [00:31:40] That’s a delightful memory.

Kenny [00:31:42] That’s the first that’s the first time I specifically remember, “I’m going to be friends with that guy” because, you know, you’re at open mics and you see faces, but you don’t know. There’s 50 comics in the room. You don’t know who’s going to be your friend yet, you know? 

Nicole [00:31:54] That’s a good point. 

Sasheer [00:31:56] Do you remember when you first hung out–just the two of you–or, like, a moment when the two of you were like, “Ooh, yes. We are clicking.”

Kenny [00:32:06] See, you know, it’s kind of hard because comedy friendships–you’re always just around comedy, especially early on. You’re just, like, talking in front of open mics. I remember talking to Dave after that set outside of this big, like, bring your A-game open mic. And I remember him and I talking. And actually, what I said to him is: “I’ve been telling people, don’t sleep on David Drake.” And he was like, “Ah, thanks, man.” I was probably trying to convince him to drink with me. And he was like, “I’ll have two drinks and go get eight hours of sleep.” I was like, “You nerd.” 

Sasheer [00:32:37] Okay. Nice. Next question is: What is your favorite memory of traveling together? 

Kenny [00:32:50] This one is easy. Well, actually, no, it’s not as easy anymore because now we’ve traveled together a lot. But I’m going to go with the first time we traveled together. I feel like this is what solidified our friendship. We went to Bonnaroo together in 2012. And it, you know, changed both of our lives really. It was the first big music festival I’d ever been to. Him, too. It was me, Dave, and our friend Cameron. And we did psychedelics for multiple days straight. And I remember I sort of realized what I wanted my comedy to look like. I got a very kind of reaffirming trip of “You’re doing the right thing, pursuing this.” And then Dave on that trip was the first time he told me about his now wife. And he was like, “When I get home, I’m going to want to shoot my shot with this girl. I really like her, blah, blah, blah.” And we got back, and within weeks they were dating. And I was a different dude. All of a sudden, I started dressing differently and shedding my Ozarks roots a little bit–being a little bit more silly and open–and not trying so hard to be cool all the damn time. And so that was a very transformative early trip for both of us. Yeah. 

Nicole [00:34:05] I love that. That’s nice. 

Sasheer [00:34:07] Yeah, it’s beautiful. 

Nicole [00:34:09] Okay, Kenny. What’s your favorite thing about your friend? 

Kenny [00:34:15] Ooh. I appreciate that Dave is exactly who he is because he is like, you know, if you don’t know Dave, he’s like, kind of offensively white. You know what I mean? And in a time where so many of us whites are doing everything in our power to be less white, Dave just powers through and just does stand up in Birkenstocks and just can’t be bothered to even adjust a single thing about himself. And honestly, I think it’s great. And you know, I’ve told him that before, but there’s such a pressure in comedy–especially for the boys–to be filthy party animals. And he’s kind of always just been healthy and let everyone call him, you know, every name under the sun for being healthy. And he just kind of stares at you and keeps eating raw kale out of a bag and is just like, “Hey, man. Say whatever you want. I’m a healthy boy.” And so, I appreciate that about him. He’s not as sensitive to peer pressure. And I think that’s a very admirable trait in a person. 

Sasheer [00:35:20] Absolutely. 

Nicole [00:35:21] Yeah, definitely. 

Sasheer [00:35:24] Okay. If you had to guess, what do you think Dave’s favorite thing is about you?

Kenny [00:35:32] I think I make Dave feel safe. He’s said this to me before. There’s been, like, situations where maybe… I can’t remember. Actually, at Bonnaroo, we went to this waterfall, and we took acid. And the acid kind of lasted longer than we expected, the park was closing, and we had to drive at night still on acid. And he was like, “I just always feel like you’re going to get me home. If you’re in charge, I’m going to be okay. Normally I’d be scared out of my mind.” And he’s kind of said that to me. I think I’m kind of, like, a stabilizing rock for him, where he’s like, “Everything’s going to be okay as long as he’s here.” And that makes me feel good, to be honest with you. 

Nicole [00:36:18] Oh, that’s nice. 

Kenny [00:36:20] I think so. 

Nicole [00:36:22] Okay. What’s something you do that drives your friend crazy? 

Kenny [00:36:29] Oh, I don’t think he likes how insecure I am. I don’t think he understands why. And I think watching me spiral, he’s just like, “You’re fucking 6’4″, dude. Stop it. You’ve got all the tools, bro. Stop not believing in yourself.” He’s literally said that to me. There’s an insecurity there that I just don’t understand. I don’t know where it comes from, and it doesn’t make any sense. And I agree with him. I would also like to get to the bottom of this. But in the meantime, I’ll just keep driving my friend crazy with my own neuroses. 

Sasheer [00:37:09] But that’s very sweet to have a friend who, like, can recognize that and, like, try to convince you otherwise. 

Kenny [00:37:17] Yeah. And I think that’s kind of what I mean. Like, you know, masculinity can be very limiting. And I feel like in a lot of ways, Dave is very… You know, because now it’s a little more in vogue for men to be in therapy–to be emotive–to not be so hard and tough. But I feel like Dave has never really been held back by that. And I actually don’t even mean that as an insult, even though if I said it to his face, I would frame it as an insult because that’s how boys communicate. But he’s just kind of always been like, “Yeah, dude, I have a Frisbee in my backpack. And if you need to talk, I’m here, man. And I’m not really worried about being cool. So, I’ll just… Whatever you want to talk about.” And it is nice. It is really nice. Yeah. 

Sasheer [00:37:57] That’s very nice. 

Nicole [00:37:59] It is nice. 

Sasheer [00:38:00] What’s something that Dave does that drives you crazy? 

Kenny [00:38:05] It’s a phrase. And it’s “It’s fine, man!” And, like, you know, sometimes it’s not fine. And he definitely thinks you can, like, just optimistically will life to be the way you want it to be. And sometimes it’s not fine, and we have to adjust what we’re doing so that we don’t die. A time that comes to mind–one time we had planned to take a little trip with our friend Lisa. And our plan was to walk down the beach in Chicago–just take an entire day. We took some mushrooms. We were going to walk down the beach, and then it started storming. And I was like, “Let’s go inside and out of the storm.” He just goes, “Ah, it’s fine, man.” And there was, like, lightning everywhere. I’m like, “It isn’t. We can go inside, let the storm pass, and continue.” So, there’s just a little bit of that, where sometimes, like… I feel like if we were on a hike and there was a bear in front of us with its mouth open, Dave would be like, “Ah, it’s fine, man. Let’s just walk into the bear’s mouth and see if we can reason with it.” And it’s just like, “Dog, we can come back later. It’s fine, man.” 

Sasheer [00:39:11] Do you remember the scariest moment like that–where he was like, “It’s fine,” but it actually was pretty dangerous?

Kenny [00:39:22] Well, we had one recently. But he was so bad, he was not like, “It’s fine.” We were actually bonded on that one. We were like, “This is not fine. And we survived.” But the time I’m thinking of–we were on a hike. I don’t know if he mentioned this, but what started as his bachelor party has become an annual guy’s trip to a different national park–which is also just hilarious that we have an annual bachelor party even though no one’s getting married. So, we go–we take psychedelics in a different park every year. That’s basically what we do. And we were in Yellowstone. And, you know, there was acid–the super-hot acid pools that are beautiful. They’re famous in Yellowstone. If you Google, you can see them. But there’s signs everywhere, “Highly acidic. No swimming.” So, we’re coming back from a hike. And so, the acid pools are, like, here, and then below it is a river. But the acid pools are clearly draining into the river. And we can see our car across the river. And Dave’s like, “I can go across the river, and I’ll just get the car and pick you guys up.” And I’m like, “No, man! You’re not walking across an acid river. What are you talking about?” “Ah, it’s fine, man.” And the amount that we had to argue with him to not risk it and just let us take the extra 30 minutes to walk around was insane. And it’s just, you know, a lot of that energy, where it’s like, “I just don’t want you to die, buddy. You know what I mean? I love you, man. I don’t want to, like, watch you incinerate. Think about me. Think about what that does to my life now.”

Nicole [00:40:58] Yeah. That would be very scarring if you just watched your friend melt into acid. 

Kenny [00:41:03] It’s not what I want on my guys’ trips. I want all the guys–every man out–you know what I mean? 

Sasheer [00:41:08] Yeah. All the guys get to go home. 

Kenny [00:41:10] I’m like a good soldier. No man gets left behind. 

Sasheer [00:41:12] That makes me think of, in Who Framed Roger Rabbit?, that green acid that they would dip the cartoons in. Do you remember this?

Kenny [00:41:21] Yes. 

Sasheer [00:41:21] Did you see that movie, Nicole? 

Kenny [00:41:22] I actually weirdly rewatched that recently. No idea why. 

Sasheer [00:41:24] Yeah. That was a terrifying image–these cartoons were getting wiped out from Toontown. And this man made this green acid concoction and would dump the cartoons in the acid, and they would disintegrate. And it’s really sad. 

Nicole [00:41:44] And this is a kid’s movie? 

Sasheer [00:41:46] You know… Was it? It was kind of a kids movie. It had a lot of adult themes in it. 

Kenny [00:41:54] Yeah, it was like a weird combo. It’s kind of the first adult cartoon that I remember, where it was like, “Oh, this is, like, kind of dark.” And I remember as a kid, it kind of scared me a little bit because all the Mafia, like, Dick Tracy-looking guys. 

Sasheer [00:42:06] Yeah. 

Kenny [00:42:08] “Oh. This is a lot to look at.”

Nicole [00:42:09] Is that the movie with the sexy rabbit lady? 

Sasheer [00:42:12] Yeah. Jessica Rabbit. 

Nicole [00:42:14] Yeah. That’s not for kids. 

Sasheer [00:42:16] No. Yeah, I don’t think so. Yeah, they had a very… I mean, I guess there’s many sexualized cartoons that were intended for kids. But this one, I think, particularly was for adults. 

Kenny [00:42:27] Yeah. You know, another quick example on this note–real quick–is… This is the first time that “It’s fine, man” was, like, unacceptable. We were in Zion National Park in Utah, which is a desert, by the way. It’s, like, 95 degrees. We’re trying to drive up to these waterfalls. We’re in rental cars. We get a quarter of the way up. A giant jeep passes us, and they signal, “Roll your window down.” So, we do, and they’re like, “You’re not going to make it in that car. You got to have an all-terrain vehicle, blah blah blah.” We’re like, “Okay.” So, we pull over, we park, and they’re like, “You know, it’s about three miles straight uphill.” And I go, “Well, we can’t do it. We have no water. We can’t hike three miles uphill.” And Dave goes, “It’s fine, man. I’m good on water.” And it’s like, “You’re not, though. You can’t just decide you don’t need water in the desert and then hike three miles uphill. Why do I have to debate you about this?” So, yeah, that’s the energy. That’s a couple of examples to give you an idea. 

Nicole [00:43:29] And that’s pretty wild. Three miles uphill? No water? No thank you. You wouldn’t survive. Speaking of which, which one of you would do better on the TV show Survivor? 

Kenny [00:43:44] Ooooh. Wow. I think it would be me because Survivor is really about forming alliances. And I think Dave would just kind of float and maybe sort of alienate himself from a little bit of this party and a little bit of this party. And then I think he would just decide he’d rather be home at some point. And this is more of a thing on me. Like, I’m a masochist, so I’m like, “Bring on the pain.” And I think I would just, like, put myself through more but from not a healthy place. You know what I’m saying? Like, I’d be like, “I have to win, or I’m a loser.” And I don’t think Dave’s as affected by that energy. 

Sasheer [00:44:34] Yeah. Also, he’d probably just fall in an acid pool or something. 

Kenny [00:44:42] Yeah. It’d be time for the torch ceremony, and Dave is just, like, in the ocean, swimming, just having a nice day, and like, “I don’t care, man. Let’s play Frisbee. Screw this.”

Sasheer [00:44:51] Yeah. Okay, last question. In 20 years, what do you hope you’re both doing? 

Kenny [00:45:00] Wow. That’s a really good question. I hope that we are both still in comedy. I hope we’re both in a healthy headspace. Still in comedy, not consumed by the industry side of it, just enjoying it, collaborating, working on things… In 20 years, I guess… You know what? I hope I’m going to his daughter Billie’s college graduation. And we’re very proud of her. And Uncle Kenny’s got a big old grin on his face. And I hope that we’ve both sold some TV shows, and everyone’s really excited to see us at Billie’s graduation. Everyone’s like, “Is that the guys that wrote the…?”That’s what I want. 

Sasheer [00:45:48] I like that. 

Nicole [00:45:49] Yeah, that’s nice. 

Sasheer [00:45:51] Good goals. Okay. 

Nicole [00:45:53] All right, that’s it. We’re going to bring Dave back and see if your answers match. 

Sasheer [00:46:01] And if they don’t, you have to end your friendship. So sorry. 

Nicole [00:46:04] Sayonara to the boys’ trips. 

Sasheer [00:46:08] It was in the fine print. You should have seen it. 

Nicole [00:46:09] Sorry about it. Should have read the whole email. 

Kenny [00:46:13] But it was… It was a DocuSign, and I just clicked through and… 

Nicole [00:46:16] Sorry about it. You gotta read. 

Sasheer [00:46:19] That’s the risk. 

Nicole [00:46:19] Well, this is… This is… Wait, hold on! Judith, is this legal? 

Sasheer [00:46:20] The Real Good Podcast by U.S. Bank aims to celebrate and gain knowledge from those working to change historical institutions and policies that disenfranchise BIPOC communities and women. Hosted by Faith Salie, each season provides the opportunity to learn from people who are on the ground, working to better their immediate communities or their industries. Topics include building community centered small businesses, bringing minority deposit institutions to new markets, the real impact of diversity programs at the corporate level, and more. This is not a banking podcast, but Faith and guests do explore how various issues impact people’s abilities to reach their goals and build generational wealth. The goal is to have open, direct discussions of the issues without sugarcoating things with corporate speak or letting corporations–including U.S. Bank–from doing their part to change systems of power for better. Listen to Real Good on all major podcast platforms or visit usbank.com/realgood. 

Nicole [00:47:40] Okay, here it is–the friendship gauntlet. We asked, “How did you two meet?” David said, “We met in Chicago, both doing open mics. And I was aware of him before I met him. So, I was like, ‘I’ll be friends with Kenny–if not now, sometime soon.’ In eight months of knowing Kenny, we became friends. I moved to Chicago. It was cold. I had no friends. Kenny also used to run a show called Speakeasy at Stanley’s and a show at the Spot in downtown Chicago.” There was also an open mic that you guys ran into each other at called Gutter Crews. It was not in a bowling alley. It was in a bar. And it was fun.”

David [00:48:24] It hurts to hear you repeat this. 

Sasheer [00:48:28] Why? 

David [00:48:30] Well, she said it was cold and I had no friends. I don’t remember saying that. 

Sasheer [00:48:35] You did, though. 

David [00:48:36] I said, “It was cold, and I had no friends”? I feel like you’re adding details to make it sadder. 

Kenny [00:48:45] “You said you were an adult virgin.”

Nicole [00:48:49] Your mattress was on the floor. You didn’t have a bedframe. You had no curtains on your windows. Everyone said, “P.U. Stinky guy.” 

Sasheer [00:48:59] We’re just quoting what you said. 

Kenny [00:49:04] You said, “I went to Chicago with my tiny wiener and…” 

Sasheer [00:49:06] “Kenny came around and saved my life.” 

Nicole [00:49:12] “He made my wiener big.”

David [00:49:14] Yeah, Kenny did it. Thank you, Kenny.

Nicole [00:49:17] You did say that you started remembering being friends with Kenny when you went to Bonnaroo in 2012. Kenny said you met doing stand-up in Chicago. Your first memory of Dave was during an open mic, Jokes and Notes, which was a predominantly Black club, which is now closed. Dave was in flip flops and shorts, and he crushed. His set ended, and the host wasn’t around. So, to make up the time, he freestyle rapped. And he’s not a good freestyle rapper, but that night he caught a flow. And the crowd went crazy and said, “Wow!”

David [00:49:51] I didn’t realize you were there for that. 

Kenny [00:49:52] I sure was. 

David [00:49:57] That was a high moment for me. Yeah, a real win. 

Sasheer [00:50:03] “In this cold, lonely…” 

David [00:50:04] “In this cold lonely city, daddy found a win.”

Nicole [00:50:08] “I finally felt some warmth from the crowd.”

Kenny [00:50:10] “I was still a virgin dork but a virgin dork that could rap.”

David [00:50:15] “And my wiener grew three sizes that day.” 

Nicole [00:50:19] That’s when Kenny decided, “I’m going to be friends with that guy.” Kenny remembers talking to people at other open mics and saying, “Don’t sleep on this guy. He’s funny.”

David [00:50:33] Thank you, baby. 

Kenny [00:50:35] Any time, buddy. 

Sasheer [00:50:37] Then we asked you guys, “What’s your favorite memory of traveling together?” Dave said, “Kenny has been on every trip I’ve taken in my adult life.” He said, “We do little boys’ trips.” Then he clarified and said, “Grown man trips.” And a memory that he has of going on tour–just the two of you–and you guys had stopped in San Antonio, Texas. And he said, “We did a late-night walk to an outdoor mall. And there was a river with restaurants.” Just a very beautiful walk. And it was just the two of you. And it sounded very sweet. 

Kenny [00:51:11] And then we parked by the river. 

David [00:51:13] It was a nice night. 

Kenny [00:51:15] And he was a virgin no more. 

David [00:51:19] Thank you, Kenny, once again for the lovely walk.

Kenny [00:51:22] I do remember that. That was super fun. As I recall, too, I think that was when I was home when my mom first was dealing with breast cancer. So, it was like a much-needed little escape to meet up and go do that. That was an awesome little Texas run. 

David [00:51:38] Well, I was thinking of just, like, times that we’ve been just the two of us. And that run was kind of the only time we’ve gone on a thing that was just us. Texas, Oklahoma, Springfield and… San Antonio was really way cooler than I thought. 

Kenny [00:51:58] Yeah. I love that town. 

Nicole [00:52:01] We got to go. 

David [00:52:04] Let’s go. 

Nicole [00:52:06] Then Kenny said the first time that you guys traveled together, which was Bonnaroo 2012. It was a big festival, and you guys did psychedelics. Kenny had a reaffirming trip that they’d be doing comedy. Dave said that he’s going to shoot his shot with his now wife. And it just seemed like the beginning of a lot of journeys for you two. 

David [00:52:28] Kenny always says that, but Bonnaroo… I, like, hooked up with a girl there. And I was not thinking about having a wife. But I did like Alex. And she texted me while I was on that trip. But Kenny thinks that I turned to him and was like…

Kenny [00:52:51] You said, I quote, “I’m ready to be in love.” That’s what you said to me. 

David [00:52:54] There’s no way I said that. 

Kenny [00:52:56] You said that to me. 

David [00:53:01] “It’s cold and I’m lonely and I’m ready to be in love.”

Kenny [00:53:02] You got your little hook up, and I think you were like, “Okay, enough of that.” And you said that to me. 

David [00:53:12] I don’t believe it. 

Kenny [00:53:13] I do. 

David [00:53:13] All right. 

Kenny [00:53:14] I have the evidence because you’re currently living in a house with her. 

David [00:53:20] Well, that could happen to anybody. 

Sasheer [00:53:25] Yeah. Maybe you were more romantic than you thought, Dave. 

David [00:53:28] Yeah. All right. Maybe I had a moment of–

Kenny [00:53:32] I mean, you were on drugs That would make you say something like that, even if you didn’t mean it. Yeah, you know what I mean? 

David [00:53:36] Okay. 

Kenny [00:53:37] Yeah, I think you probably also told that random girl that brought us water that you loved her. 

David [00:53:43] I was telling a lot of people I was ready to be in love.

Kenny [00:53:43] I think you told Skrillex that you love him.

Nicole [00:53:52] We asked, “What’s your favorite thing about your friend?” Dave said, “Kenny is really good at bringing drugs across state lines. I’m too scared, but Kenny can do it. He brought a pound of mushrooms on a plane the last trip we took, it looked like a travel toiletry case that he put it in.” Kenny said, “I appreciate that Dave is actually who he is. You don’t know him. He’s kind of offensively white. He does stand-up in Birkenstocks, and I think that’s great. There’s a pressure for boys to be filthy party animals, and he’s always been healthy and not succumbing to peer pressure.”

David [00:54:29] Well, now I feel kind of bad because that was kind of nice. You said you like me for who I am. And I said I like that you commit felonies for me.

Kenny [00:54:42] Hey, man, that’s also nice. Thank you for saying I’m brave. It was an ounce of mushrooms, by the way–not a pound. That would be obscene. 

David [00:54:49] It just looked like a lot. 

Kenny [00:54:50] Yeah, it was a lot. It was silly. I got a little cocky. The confidence of white men who evade the law–it knows no bounds. 

David [00:55:00] It scared me when you showed it to me. And then I realized that you brought it on a plane. I couldn’t have been more happy and pleased with you. But I was like, “Wow. That’s something.” 

Kenny [00:55:20] Yeah. We’re going to be smarter next year. This was a kind of a panic last minute decision. 

David [00:55:24] But I like who you are, too. 

Kenny [00:55:26] Oh, wow. Thanks, buddy. 

David [00:55:27] Yeah. 

Nicole [00:55:28] I like that it’s a real afterthought. “That’s pretty good.”

Sasheer [00:55:31] We asked, “What’s your friend’s favorite thing about you?” Dave said, “I think Kenny likes how simply I speak. He said to me before that he likes how I just say things. I don’t really doll it up. And Kenny likes word economy. Be literal.” I still don’t know what that means, but that’s what Dave said.

Kenny [00:56:00] He just speaks very plainly. 

David [00:56:01] It makes sense to Kenny. 

Kenny [00:56:02] People be like, “Do you like this?” And Dave will go, “No, I think it’s bad.” And most people would be like, “Wow, you know, maybe if I saw it again, you know…” There’s none of that. “This is bad. This is good. You’re an idiot.” Just right to everyone’s face. It’s pretty remarkable. 

Sasheer [00:56:21] And then Kenny said, “I think I make Dave feel safe. He said this to me before at Bonnaroo or taking acid at a waterfall. Dave said, ‘I feel like you’re always going to get me home.’ I’m like a stabilizing rock for him.”

David [00:56:40] I mean, I feel like that’s fair. Kenny is safe. Yeah. I mean, you’re tall and strong. And when I’m around you, I guess I feel like it’s going to be okay. 

Nicole [00:56:58] That’s nice! It’s a nice thing to feel about your friend.

Kenny [00:57:00] You better say that. I’m taking you back to the river in San Antonio.

David [00:57:03] Don’t leave me by the river again, Kenny. 

Kenny [00:57:07] You keep talking that nice talk, and we’re going back to that river walk, baby. 

David [00:57:11] Yeah, this really safe man is full of threats today. I feel so safe.

Nicole [00:57:20] We asked, “What’s something you do that drives your friend crazy?” Dave said, “The only time Kenny’s been really mad at me is on our little boys’ trip. On a hike, I’ll wander off too far. Wandering off makes Kenny crazy. I just wander off a bit sometimes because, you know, you want some peace. And he gets worried because it’s dangerous. And he got mad because I hiked back in the dark. Kenny was worried. He thought I was dead. And I was with another friend. We were gone for 45 minutes in the dark. And when he yelled at me, I got that sinking feeling, like when you’re at the principal’s office and the principal’s yelling at you.”

Kenny [00:57:55] I do have big dad energy. That’s true. And as it turns out, I learned a little something about anxious attachment styles when I heard you read that back to me. Wow. 

David [00:58:04] Well, it also plays in probably to the safety I feel–to have someone who’s so concerned about me lost in the dark. 

Sasheer [00:58:12] That’s right. 

Kenny [00:58:14] And I think you’ll find my answer really plays into your answer. Go on. 

Nicole [00:58:17] Yes, Kenny said, “I don’t think Dave likes how insecure I am. I think him watching me spiral will make him want to say, ‘You need to start believing in yourself.’” Kenny does want to get to the bottom of this, but in the meantime, he’s just going to drive him crazy with his neuroses. Sorry. There’s one more bit. Masculinity put you in a box, but Dave has never been affected by that. He’s always just himself. 

David [00:58:43] Kenny, you’re so kind to me. Aside from that river thing, you’ve been really nice. But, yeah, I mean, your neuroses don’t really bother me because, you know, we all have those. So, I actually don’t mind talking through friends’ problems because it always helps me look at my own problems when a friend has something going on with them because more times than not, it also applies to, you know, feelings that you have in yourself. 

Kenny [00:59:24] That’s very nice of you to say, David. 

David [00:59:26] Oh, thank you, Kenny. I don’t know what this podcast is supposed to be. Sincere or– 

Sasheer [00:59:33] No, we like sincerity. We like hearing people talk about the love they have for their friends. 

David [00:59:38] Yeah. 

Kenny [00:59:39] It feels like a real will-they-won’t-they? on this episode. 

Sasheer [00:59:42] And we know the answer is you already have. 

Kenny [00:59:46] Will-they-won’t-they? They did.

David [00:59:47] There is a strong sexual undercurrent. And it’s not just my shirt. 

Sasheer [00:59:54] We asked, “What is something your friend does that drives you crazy?” Dave said, “Honestly, there’s not much that my friends can do to make me mad. However, occasionally Kenny will have a bad sketch idea. He’ll ask, ‘What do you think of this?’ And he needs me to, like, believe in it because he does. And I can see that the idea is not going anywhere. But he also has plenty of good ideas. I just want to be part of the bad ones.” And then Kenny said…

David [01:00:22] How are you going to jump right out of that? 

Sasheer [01:00:23] Unless you want to comment on it? 

David [01:00:26] No need to elaborate further. 

Kenny [01:00:29] We’ll be elaborating. Go on. Off-air. Much like Sasheer, Dave, you have something coming to you.

David [01:00:43] Oh no. Kenny is full of threats for now two thirds of the other people on this podcast. 

Kenny [01:00:48] That’s right. 

Sasheer [01:00:51] And then Kenny said, “It’s a phrase called ‘It’s fine, man.’ Sometimes it’s not fine. He believes that sometimes he can will life into what you want, and sometimes you can’t. One time our plan was to walk with our friend Liza on mushrooms. And it started to storm outside. And Dave was like, ‘It’s fine, man.’ And I was like, ‘It’s not. It’s storming outside. We should go inside.’” There’s actually many examples of this. “Then there was a time where we were on a hike in Yellowstone and there were acid pools. And we were coming back from a hike, and the acid was draining to the river. Dave said he would walk in the river to get to the car. And we had to talk him down. We’d rather walk an extra 30 minutes to get there safely.”

David [01:01:35] Glad we did. But to be fair, you could tell the river was fine. Anyway, sorry. I don’t mean to interrupt, but… 

Sasheer [01:01:47] There was one more example. In Zion National Park in Utah, you were going into the park. And you were told that the car wasn’t going to make it up the hill. It was hot outside. And you were told you could hike three miles uphill in the heat. And Dave was like, “No, I’m good on water. We can make the hike,” even though you had no water in the car. And he kept saying, “It’s fine.” And Kenny believes it was not. 

David [01:02:17] That’s fair. It was too hot. You do need water. 

Nicole [01:02:24] Yeah. You need water on a hike. 

David [01:02:26] It’s a cornerstone of life. Sorry. 

Nicole [01:02:34] We asked, “Which of you would do better on Survivor?” Dave said, “Kenny would do better. He’s always sending links to camel packs and interesting shoes–hiking shoes, shoes you can walk into the water, adventure shoes! Kenny knows that there are risks, so he prepares for it.” Kenny said, “I think it would be me because it’s about forming alliances. And I think Dave would just float and alienate himself from, you know, the people there. And I think he would just decide to go home. And I think I’m a masochist so I could put myself through more pain.”

David [01:03:05] Oh. So, you think I would just leave?

Kenny [01:03:09] Yeah. I don’t think you’d care. I think, like, you would just, like, go swimming when everyone else is forming alliances. 

David [01:03:15] It’s $1,000,000, Kenny. 

Kenny [01:03:18] That’s true. 

David [01:03:20] I’m going to play. 

Sasheer [01:03:27] You’re going to at least try. But you did both agree that it was Kenny. 

David [01:03:29] Yeah. I do think Kenny would be better. Although now that I remember what Survivor is, you are a capable person, and I think that hurts you because I think they get rid of the capable ones because that’s a threat to themselves. 

Sasheer [01:03:45] Yeah, they vote people out that are threatening. 

David [01:03:47] Now that I remember the game of the show, I believe in myself a little bit better. 

Kenny [01:03:54] Yeah.

David [01:03:54] Less capable, but easy to get along with. So non-threatening. They’ll keep me around longer. 

Kenny [01:04:03] Plus, you have your bandana on, and that just kind of looks right. 

David [01:04:06] Yeah. That’s skills. 

Sasheer [01:04:11] All looks, less skills.

David [01:04:12] All looks, less skills. I think that goes pretty far in Survivor. 

Sasheer [01:04:15] Yeah. Okay. And then the last question we asked was: What do you hope you’re both doing in 20 years from now? And I’ll read Kenny’s answer first. Kenny said, “I hope we’re still both doing comedy, we’re both in a healthy headspace–not consumed by the industry side of things–and we’re collaborating with each other. And I hope I’m going to his daughter Billie’s graduation and we’ve both written some TV shows and people are really excited to see us there and they’re like, ‘Oh, look at those guys who wrote those things.’” And then Dave said…

David [01:04:50] I feel like I had a stroke during this question. I was thinking about it after I said it. I was like, “What have I done?”

Kenny [01:05:00] Oh, I cannot wait.

David [01:05:01] I put it on a podcast. Whatever. 

Nicole [01:05:03] It was very much like you couldn’t imagine the future. You were like, “Is the world going to go on past today?” 

David [01:05:14] I mean, to be honest, my first thought was Kenny laying flowers on my grave. 

Sasheer [01:05:20] Oh my God. 20 years from now?

David [01:05:21] I didn’t say that. Well, you know… 

Nicole [01:05:24] Okay, this is what you actually said. First you said, “I hope we both have some money or one of us has some money. Or if one of us has the money, I hope it’s me. And I hope we’re both not working at a moving company.” And then I said I’d like to challenge you to think of it a bit more in the future. And then he said, “In 20 years, me and Kenny got some new adventure shoes, a face mask, and we’re walking into the world as it burns up before us in some post-apocalyptic reality.” And then we said, “Please answer again.” And then he said… 

David [01:06:08] I hate this. 

Nicole [01:06:11] I mean, this is your answer. You said it. 

David [01:06:13] I needed more time. 

Sasheer [01:06:18] And then the one that he wanted to declare as the real answer was both of you being in a nice house. Both of you have daughters that go to school together and are friends and. And that’s it. And that sounds nice. 

David [01:06:35] Our daughters are friends. 

Kenny [01:06:36] There you go. 

Sasheer [01:06:37] Eventually you got there. 

David [01:06:40] Sorry about the other ones. Those ones hurt me a little bit. We all make mistakes and think about them. 

Kenny [01:06:53] Only need one of us to make money. We’ll get there, though.

David [01:06:53] I’ll be thinking about this. 

Nicole [01:06:57] I think the verdict is you guys are friends. 

Sasheer [01:06:59] Yeah. You definitely have a relationship where you need each other. Someone needs to take care of Dave.

David [01:07:05] But we all bring a little something to the table. 

Sasheer [01:07:11] And Dave has fun bandanas… And more. No, you’re clearly friends, and you can stay friends. 

Nicole [01:07:28] Yes. You can stay. 

Kenny [01:07:30] All right. Another year, another guy’s trip. Let’s go! 

Sasheer [01:07:32] Yeah. Little boys’ trip!

David [01:07:35] More little boys’ trips. 

Nicole [01:07:36] Dave, did you have anything you wanted to promote specifically? 

David [01:07:40] I have a new special coming out in fall called That’s It. And so, you can keep an eye out for information on that at my Instagram, daviddrakecomedy, or my website, daviddrakecomedy.com. 

Sasheer [01:07:53] Great. 

Nicole [01:07:56] And Kenny, what would you like to promote? 

Kenny [01:07:59] So, my newest special–Don’t You Know Who I am?–is now free on YouTube. And the audio only version has 20+ bonus minutes of material, and you can stream that anywhere you get your albums. And follow me at @kennydeforest on Instagram or TikTok. Yeah, those are the two I care about. 

Nicole [01:08:24] Perfect. Thank you so much for doing this!

Sasheer [01:08:26] Yes. Thank you for doing this. 

Kenny [01:08:28] It was so fun. 

Nicole [01:08:29] We didn’t answer any emails this episode, but guess what? We will. We love your queries. We love your questions. We also love compliments. And you can send compliments to nicoleandsasheer@gmail.com. Or you can text us or phone in your compliments at 424-645-7003. Also, we have transcripts for our new episodes. Complimentary. You can check them out on our show page at earwolf.com. 

Sasheer [01:09:00] Lastly, don’t forget to rate, review, and subscribe. That is the easiest way to support this show! We also have merch at podswag.com/bestfriend. And now we have a sale till the end of the month where you can type in “bestfriends50” at podswag.com/bestfriends and get 50% off our merch. 

Nicole [01:09:17] Honestly, the ultimate compliment is to wear us on you. Who doesn’t love a sale? 

Sasheer [01:09:24] Thank you so much. 

Nicole [01:09:28] No worries. I’ll always amplify you, friend.